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THE ARCHIVES
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Morrigan's Pit has closed down as of November 2006. The site and its articles will stay online as an archive until September at least, but probably longer.
The Archives
2002-2006
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HOLY MOSES
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Sabina Classen
April 2005
http://www.holymoses.de
On April 10 we went to Landgraaf very early, where Rock Inc had organized a pressday, with Lars Ratz (Metalium), Sabina Classen (Holy Moses) and Hank Shermann (Force Of Evil, Mercyful Fate). After some chatting about the gig we saw the day before (Mosh It Up in Sabina's hometown Aachen) they were surprised Theo didn't know about so they could've gone there instead of drinking in a local café. What a pity, but oh well. Sabina was my second victim in the morning and you know how it is with girls - they just won't stop! In our enthusiasm and spontaneity we talked for almost an hour until Theo told us to wrap it up ;)
You have your 10th studio album out, "Strength Power Will Passion", I think it fits the album very well.
It was the only title I could choose! After all these years and all these people talking in my ear, do like this, do like that, the only thing you need to go on in this business is to do what your heart is saying and you need strength, power, will and passion to do it. So when I was thinking about how I feel now and listened to the first riffs we wrote, it was the real description of my life. Now I'm growing older I realize what I need to do in this business and it was clear that this should be the title of the album, hehe!
It was the first time without Andy Classen, whose choice was that?
That was a choice of Andy and me together. He was in on the reunion in 2001, but not in the live line-up, because he's now a big producer. He's a more quiet and introvert guy, so he didn't like to be on stage anymore. He was still a songwriter for "Master Of Disaster" and "Disorder Of The Order", but I had other people playing live with me. And I was feeling that the power we have now on stage can't be on an album if the people who are writing this album are not in the band. In the last 3 years we've grown tight together and when Michael Hanker joined the band I felt he was like a soulmate from Andy in his songwriting, he transported into Holy Moses what he felt. It wouldn't be right to have Andy write, he can't get the feeling what Holy Moses is about now. We have to look to the future and not too much in the past, we have 2005 now. Michael was so involved in the band, he feels Holy Moses as if he was in the band since the beginning. Then we wrote the first riffs together and it was going up and up. So I asked Andy and said, "don't be disappointed.." and he said "No! You freed myself, cool! Do what you need to do now!".
How did the writing with Michael go?
We were sitting in a small studio and when I came over he was always like "go away, go away, I'm writing!" but he had to read my lyrics, if they would fit the songs and then he was putting it together and we ended up with 28 songs! We did 3 or 4 with the whole band in the rehearsal room, some in the small studio directly in my house, late at night after drinking some whiskey and gettings lots of ideas - after 3 years we had 28 songs and could decide what was good for the band or my voice and that is on the album now.
And the recording, you got another producer, right?
Yes, Schrödey, he did the engineering and co-producing, he's our live mixer so he knows how we sound live and he was my ex-guitarplayer in Temple Of The Absurd. So it was again a perfect situation. Michael and Schrödey both know me live, played with me in the band and know ME, because I'm not easy in the studio, I still get lots of ideas about how I can sing things.
The production sounds really really great, really in-your-face.
Cool, thanks!
How do you think is it different from the last releases?
The most important thing is that we changed the songwriting part and that we were not thinking about the old days. When we did "Master Of Disaster" and "Disorder Of The Order" there was a lot of pressure on me from fans, the media, so everybody expected something. Knowing that when you go into the studio, you get in trouble with yourself, "am I doing the right thing" and this time we put all this aside.
I guess that's an evolution as well, that you needed to do those things to come to a point where you say, "hey this is me and this is what I'm doing".
Hehe yeah! I didn't talk to anyone anymore, I said I was going to do now what I wanted to do. And I wasn't thinking whether it should sound like "Finished With The Dogs", it's history and I now do what I feel now in 2005, what is Sabina now and what am I doing now that I'm growing older. I have my business, my job, so I can do like I did in 1986, '87! When I never expected anything, where I only did music and this is what I changed this time again, again back to that, that was the only thing back to the roots that I freed myself and I'm doing it for myself. And if other people like it too, than it's fine! To free myself was the best thing I ever did, at age 41 I freed myself from everybody, so you see that you learn when you grow older. I freed myself and I'm happy :)
Since you brought the age up, I'm 41 too ;)
Ahh hahaha! (laughter)
1963 was definitely a good year ;) People probably think you are a lot younger as well (as with me)?
But I can't lie, because they can see that I started up in 1981 ;)
I would never lie about it, if anything, be proud! But I'm curious what you tell people what keeps you young (whether it's the same as what I say hehe)
Sex, drugs and rock 'n roll!! (laughter)
Drugs won't keep you young I think, hehe
No, the power, the adrenaline is a drug too. Some people need chemical drugs, but my drug is the music. The power of thrash metal (it's all rock 'n roll) and the passion I have for it are my drugs, this is my life. Others need cocaine or something to go "weeeeeehhhh!" and for me, I am my own drug, hahaha! But I'm happy that I can say I have this drug. When I see people that take chemical drugs, I think "oh no, they need a passion in their lives". They are losing, or never had the passion, for their lives. That's what I also try to tell in my lyrics, to younger people, please don't take any kind of drugs, find your own drug and keep looking forward. It's not easy now for younger people, they have so many influences from computer games and stuff. We didn't have that, we went to play soccer in the streets, meet friends, have a party. What I see now is that many kids are really alone, alone with all the influences, they don't have any idea about their lives. I get angry when I see people getting lazy because of it and watching soaps on TV...
Wait, wait, I watch one! (laughter) As The World Turns! (hey, gotta defend my ATWT! ;))
Hahaha! I don't know that one ;)
But kids need to find their own ideas and influences they can put into themselves and this is something I try to tell with the lyrics and this album too. Find you own passion and no drugs, and it keeps you young ;)
I always say, "lots of heavy metal and no kids". No offence, kids are beautiful, but it takes a lot of energy too. We are happy with our lives and I'm no musician, but metal is our drive too.
Haha yeah! You don't have to be a musician, you only have to find your passion and what you want to do with your life. Find a hobby and keep doing it, that keeps you alive and young. (After some chatting about Nico's age and grey hair, how men look more interesting with grey hair...) After this interview all my fans are going to dye their hair grey, hahaha! (laughter)
Tell me something about the hidden track...
Hahaha you found it?! It's with Tom Angelripper, he's a really good friend of mine and he's always singing these typical German party songs on his albums. This one is from Henry Valentino, an old German "schlager" singer. One time at Wacken, in the night when we were really drunk, he started to sing (sings) "Im Wagen vor mir fährt ein junges Mädchen" and I forgot about it. In the last days of the production Michael was playing it and said "you have to put it on the album!" and then I phoned Tom! I said, "we have to sing it" and I emailed my files to him, he took them to the studio to do his thing, made an mp3 of it and sent it back hehe! Modern communication! In Germany the song was really famous in the 80's, so it's a gag.
What can you tell me about the lyrics, is there a concept?
I'd say, the concept of my life. Like in "Angel Cry" there are angels crying in my ear, they stop me and say "don't look around, do what you want to do" and each time I'm wondering about what others are thinking, the angels cry "hey Sabina, be on your way". "Symbol Of Spirit": I sometimes try to go deeper into myself and see if there is a spirit and what it is. This pentagram is like a mandala for me, to be careful that other influences don't come into your heart and your soul too much, that you can go your own way and clear your space around. There is one song "Space Clearing" about when I sometimes come home after touring, jobs etc and I think "oh my god, how is it looking here! I have to clean up!" and then you're sitting on your couch "oh no I don't want to do it" because it's dirty and clothes everywhere to wash and dry. And I like to buy goodies on the tours, so my apartment gets full with crappy things and sometimes I do some space clearing to free myself. Sometimes you have to free your mind, it's the same as with old furniture, or when you get a present from someone you don't like and looking at it you will always have a bad memory, but you won't put it away. And now I learned to throw it away!
So I don't really tell a story, but sometimes things around me make me angry. And I have the chance, when I sing, to let it all out. "Rebirthing" is about how I can let it out from my stomach and it cleans my body, it has to do with how you are breathing. With your breathing you can refresh yourself and your body, so on stage it's sometimes like I get a whole shower of my inner blood ;)
The artwork is from Markus Mayer..
Yes, it's the first he did for us, I saw things he did for Nightwish and others and he is really involved in what I mean with "Strength Power Will Passion". When I told him my concept he said, "I have the perfect cover for you. What you're thinking is something I'm thinking about too." We both hate people that just hang around and do nothing, blame others for it, because they have no passion. Markus said he feels the same and had painted a picture of it.. the unbelievable thing was that it already had "strength power will passion" on it. I was like "oh my god, it's not possible" and he asked if I wanted it as the cover. He said he would put my picture on the one that was in it, as if I was coming out of it and to show it's my protection. The pentagram protects me and my head and my thinking of the influences of others. He knew the story of my words when I hadn't even written down all my words, that's when I said, "yes, you're my man!".
I agree with the "we are gods" thing etc, but why then the satanic symbols, isn't that a similar thing, to worship a god or a satan?
No, people think satanic things have to do with evil, but it's more that there's a satan in everybody, for me it's someone that protects you and you have to find your own satan who protects you. "We are gods" mean that you have to find your own idea about your life so you can be your own god and god is always you. This is a philosophy about you finding your own way. For me it's really hard, I don't accept anyone telling me what to do.
I totally agree, but for me it means I don't want any religion, I don't believe in any personification of a god or satan or whatever.
It's only to show people they have to find their own way, whether it's for satan, god, buddha whatever, YOU have to go your straight way.
The image of you in the website design, is that also from Markus?
No, that's from Kai, our graphic guy, who's doing the rest of the booklet.
On the new album I love your vocals a lot, much better than on the one other cd I have, "Master Of Disaster" (it's been too long since I've heard the old stuff I had on vinyl) where it was more screeching and now it's much deeper, darker.
It's the same, it feels really good, this is my voice, how I like to hear my voice. On "Master Of Disaster" I had to find my voice back, with Temple Of The Absurd I did something different. In the past years I found my voice back by playing live a lot, that's the best way. I tried to put what I love live into the record.
You kinda accidentally started singing and back then you didn't intend to sing in this way - but you continued with it, what have you done since to improve your voice and take care of it?
Only singing. I really did nothing hehe. When I started out I was thinking about a record deal or that this would be my life. I never went to a coach and rehearsing is like when you play soccer, you have to do it every day otherwise you get problems with your muscles and the vocal strings are the same. When I sing every day I'm fine.
But when you use them in a wrong way you can lose your voice...
You feel it. When I use them in a wrong way or when I'm talking too much. On tour it's like I'm arrogant, but if I talk the whole night up against the music, I get in real trouble. Talking is harder than singing. At one point my record company said I should get a vocal coach, it was a girl who was into pop music etc., she tried to explain to me how to get my breath to make it right and then she said, "but first I need to listen to your music". So I put the CD on and she said, "I'm not going to coach you, you are doing the worst thing for your voice, you will lose it in two years, I don't want to coach you". I said, "ok, goodbye" hehe!
Who inspires you vocally?
When I was starting out I wasn't thinking of other singers. I like Sabbath, but I'm not sounding like Ozzy Osbourne (laughter).. so I just sung my own way. I had no one to look up to and I couldn't do coversongs, I only have my voice and I can't imitate anyone at all! We only did "Too Drunk To Fuck" from the Dead Kennedys and "Fight For Your Right" what Uli Kusch was singing. I was the first female growling and then I heard others doing it, like Chuck Schuldiner, Tom Araya of Slayer, Cronos from Venom, Celtic Frost.. and I was like "hey, there are others singing just like me.. cool!" Nobody influenced each other because it was all new, but it helped me to stay, because on our first gig in Aachen people really ran out. It was totally loud, we had a PA on stage as a backline, we went to other concerts like Iron Maiden and saw their big backlines, so we said, "that's what we need for our own festival". We put everything on 10 and it was only loud, and then my growling and people thought "oh my god...this is crap, they will never get a recorddeal". We didn't want to have a recorddeal, we just wanted to go "waaaaaaahh!" ;) But afterwards it helped me that there were others and I thought "hey I'm not the only one, I'm doing okay!".
And in writing music, I mean you're still a fan as well.
In the beginning, on the old demos, you can really hear the influences from old Black Sabbath and some Accept, but I think we did it our own way, if you listen to any of it you think "hey that's Holy Moses". This is cool, because nowadays, when I listen to a lot of new bands (in my work for Armageddon Music , doing A&R, I get a lot of demo tapes every day) and oh again, this sounds like that, that sounds like that, it's hard to find a new band that has their own ideas. I mean a guitar has only a few riffs and you can't have a new heavy metal, but the combinations can still be interesting. I'm glad we did it in the 80's and we could develop our own thing, but younger bands have a problem nowadays.
(this is the time for me to pitch Into Eternity, who in my opinion are doing something 'new' in the way they combine death, prog, several clean and death vocals etc ;))
Anyway.. you've had a long history with Holy Moses, if you look back, is there something you would do differently?
On one side, yes a lot of things, but on the other side if I did all these things in another way, with my knowledge now, I would not be sitting here today. Every mistake I've made in my life IS my life. I can only learn from it and compare when I now have a similar situation and try to do it better. The good thing is that we are all human and I make a lot of mistakes for the 2nd and 3rd time. And then I think, it can't be a mistake, because it's my person and I don't want to change my person. I like to grow up, but that thing in me makes me the person who I am, so I think "okay, I'm doing the same thing again, but okay, that's me!" (some chat about how you learn to be comfortable with your own flaws and mistakes when you grow older and that you can only be just yourself anyway) You always think you are ready, when you're 18 and you think... (both simultaneously)"I'm grown up now!!!!" (laughter) ... and then you keep learning. When I phoned my grandma for her 88th birthday, her head is still working great, I asked how she was feeling and she said, "Sabina, this morning I looked into the mirror and I said, hey you are now 88, but I look like 30 and I feel like 30!" haha! I grow up and I learn more and more about myself, to accept my mistakes and my personality and that keeps me going on. Everytime I tried to change me, I made more mistakes, so THAT was a mistake.
What has been the best and/or biggest gig you've done with Holy Moses?
The first was the Dynamo Open Air in 1989, because I went to the first Dynamo in Eindhoven in 1986 and I said "I want to be on this stage!" and only a few years later I was on that stage! It was a great feeling, I think there were 20,000 people at that time, but to me it felt like a 100 million haha! And then Wacken Open Air in 2001 really filled up, totally nervous because it was the first show again for Holy Moses and in the same year we played South-Korea on the Busan International Rock Festival, we were co-headlining for 20- or 30,000 people. It was strange, there was an area for people over 25, an area for under 16 and an area for older ones, a big stage with 3 levels with elevators, so that was something really special too.
Is Korea comparable to Japan, the courteous people etc?
Yeah there was a perfect organisation, it was all in the rider, "you have to eat at this time, you have to do this, you have to do that, you have an interview" and people were just looking a lot. We were on the beach and someone came over, knowing we were German and white and they don't have hair on their arms, so he was looking at that, "aahh!", and then: "you are the Scorpions?" hahahahaha! (laughter) Yeah, I'm Klaus Meine hahaha! That was really funny.
What are your future liveplans? First you have the Wacken Road Show coming up with Illdisposed, Regicide and Suidakra?
That's only 14 days in Germany and then we have some festivals like Rock Harz and Wacken Open Air, some festivals in Czech Republic and Hungary and then we want to do a Europe tour, so we hope to come to Holland, Belgium as well. We want to go back to Scandinavia, last year we played the Inferno Festival and it was a really great thing, we seem to have a lot of fans in Scandinavia. And hopefully we can do the U.S. and Japan this year for the first time. A lot of plans, we'll see what happens. The album is really new and fresh, so we will see how the reactions will be and go from there. We're prepared, we'll see what comes in, we'll look at everything, we want to go on stage, that's the most important thing. Whether it's a festival with 50,000 people or a club with 100 people, I enjoy everything, but esp. the clubs. Festivals are good for us to show the younger people who don't know Holy Moses, who we are, I see the festival as a promotion for the club shows. I hope those who like us will come to the clubs, I need the interaction, I need to talk to the fans and on a festival you have 10m to the crowds, that's always strange for me. Last time when we played in 2003 instead of Sinister, there were two security people who knew me from 2001, "oh no Sabina, she's going again, how do we secure her", I always went to the people. I need that, I have to look into the faces. So I'm happy to play clubs too.
I think there is only one man who can really rule a festival, I don't think he could even be as good in a club: Dee Snider (some chat about Dee Snider's overwhelming personality and impact on a festival crowd, and us)
What has been, or would be, your favorite band to play with?
I never played with my favorite band, that would be Slayer. But I really liked the tour we did with Pro-Pain, really nice guys, no problems, it was a good tour, nobody stole each other's beer haha! The guys let me go shower first hehe. For me it's important that the people like each other, so that it's like a big family going on tour, like when we played two weeks ago with Dew-Scented, it was like a family together, so everybody helps each other, that was really great.
It would be a dream to play with Slayer or bands like Cannibal Corpse or Morbid Angel. When I was younger I always wanted to go on tour with Venom. In 1986 or so Doro was in Warlock and on tour with Venom and I was really jealous hehe! She's always been a good friend and I called her "hey what's this, you go on tour with them and I sit here at home!" and she said, "oh sorry, I didn't know, what can we do about it?!" (laughter) It's typical Doro, she is so nice.
Holy Moses would've fit Venom better.
Yeah, she said that too hehehe!!
What are your favorite countries you've played or where you'd like to play?
I really love every country, you meet new people, get new inspirations, it's really interesting to see how people in other countries react. Korea was a special thing. I'm always nervous when I go to another country and talk to the people, because you get so many things back and hear stories. In 2002 we toured in Eastern Europe, like Croatia and the old Yugoslavia part and you'd see the bombed streets. We talked to the people there and they told stories about the war, what happened in the middle of the night, when in Germany everything was fine, a few km from your home there was a real war, you saw it in the faces of the people and how happy they react that we go now on to tour and come to their club. And the surrounding of the club is still bombed. If I weren't doing music, I wouldn't go there, this is not my dream country for a holiday. For holiday I always go to Spain ;) I like the sun and to relax and to listen to completely different music..
Yeah we have Greece for that :)
I'd really like to play Greece, I've never done that. And Spain, never played there! Next weekend when I'm there for promotion, I'll have to talk to the promotor that we want to play there!
Ok, we need to wrap it up: anything you want to add?
Oh, I think I already, once again, talked too much hehe!
It was my pleasure, thanks erm, Klaus! ;)
submitted by Marlies 07.05.2005
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